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Open-source Server Administration program


tbot

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Would the MTA dev team oppose the release of an open-source C++ program which basically functions like MTAMA, except that it's multi-platform and thus can run on the same host as the server itself (without the dependency on mIRC)?

Since it involves reverse-engineering the administration protocol I'm a bit weary about whether the dev team will like it. :?:

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Whether 'scripting' will be easier with such a program depends on the person who is doing it. To create scripts requires sufficient knowledge of C++.

As for the open-source, my design is based on a static dynamic design. That means that the structure of the program is extendible, but it does require recompiling (and thus having the source).

I do want to emphasize the advantages for server admins. Many don't have the ability to run mIRC 24/7, and due to that choose to not run scripts (I also know an admin who _does_ run scripts, using mIRC under vmware in linux, a bit CPU-intensive for some little scripts, don't you think?).

Besides that C++ opens more possibilities (for example, MySQL logging to create an interface to PHP, as well as much more).

To sum it all up, MTAMA is limited and slow, and the mIRC scripting language isn't the neatest language around...

This program should act as a replacement.

(p.s. The idea just popped into my mind that it maybe is possible to not be fully open-source through releasing precompiled static link libraries for the common platforms. Yet, if it's possible, I don't think it's a very neat solution... :roll: )

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MTAMA 3.0 is a faster then the previos version but it depend how many script ur running :)

Hmm.. 1000+ lines of code on 3 servers ? Is it much??

It takes about 40% CPU load on a Athlon 1700+, so i couldn't play MTA anymore because of the lag. The solution with a virtual machine worked great, except i trashed up my linux kernel so VMWare doesn't run anymore. So a mIRC for linux would be nice ;)

TBOT's C++ linux program looks very attractive, i hope it will work.

MTAMa is a great addon, but some competition wouldn't be bad.

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a major drawback of C++ for this purpose, is that its not very string friendly, parsing and such is much easier w/ perl or something like that.. which is why a lot of people prefer the mirc option... as for approval, the MTA team cannot support this as our Admin protocol is still a bit untested for security, and it wouldnt' be wise to give out any info people could pick up on.

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i think it isn't a good idea, cause not much people know C++

Do much people know mIRC script? Sure, it is easier to use, but i think that is a problem too. Some servers i visited had such bad scripting, they could better turn it off. With this solution, with a good modular approach (which they are using) there are only a few people writing scripts/ programs, and the rest are using them.

This guarantees better scripts for everyone. With a webpage with loadable / insertable plugins i think the problem with the scripting is minimal. But you're free to use MTAMA offcourse :) I will use it until this one is finished, and i will test them both before deciding which one i will use afterwards.

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Hmmz mIRC scripting is easy for me i 'learned' the basic commands in 1 week. I try to implent as much as i can in the DLL to make it faster i might make a own *.exe and using it own sockets. I can trigger the events my using filemapping. But i'm not sure if it works for costum commands (aliases).

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muirc scripting is easy to learn, like i learned the basics in a day (not that i know more than the basics) but C++ is much harder to leran than mirc scripting

Yes, that's what i tried to say. But can you program anything somebody else hasn't made yet? If the c++ code is public available, there's no need for most people to build their own scripts. Sure, it's 'cool' you build your own scripts, but why keep reinventing the same things? I don't see the point. I'd prefer downloading something fast, that write my own scripts, with all the bugs they might contain.

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there's loads of stuff that isn't made yet, like i'm scripting a new game-mode, but we can't script much new things, due to the possibilities from admin to server, so i think it wouldn't make much difference since the admin has limits

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mIRC scripting is limited. For example, try logging to a MySQL server for doing webstats...

I agree that for a novice programmer C++ is quite hard, but then again, I don't aim on eliminating MTAMA. Those who prefer mIRC scripting could still use MTAMA.

But if you want to run scripts 24/7 I don't see mIRC as an option on a server, it's just way too much overhead.

I'm already running test versions on my own server, and they seem to work very well. I just don't want to keep this advantage for myself only...

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mIRC scripting is limited. For example, try logging to a MySQL server for doing webstats...

I agree that for a novice programmer C++ is quite hard, but then again, I don't aim on eliminating MTAMA. Those who prefer mIRC scripting could still use MTAMA.

But if you want to run scripts 24/7 I don't see mIRC as an option on a server, it's just way too much overhead.

I'm already running test versions on my own server, and they seem to work very well. I just don't want to keep this advantage for myself only...

dll's, dlls.

"/dll MySQL.dll w00t"

See http://www.mircscripts.org

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  • 4 weeks later...

As some time has passed the program is becoming more stable and mature. Since we get almost only positive reactions to the scripts ran by the program we might consider releasing it publicly.

So, as for the fact that you oppose releasing it open-sourced. My question to the team now is whether you oppose releasing it as configurable pre-compiled binaries?

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As some time has passed the program is becoming more stable and mature. Since we get almost only positive reactions to the scripts ran by the program we might consider releasing it publicly.

So, as for the fact that you oppose releasing it open-sourced. My question to the team now is whether you oppose releasing it as configurable pre-compiled binaries?

I'm going to speak for the team on this matter though someone else will probably want to correct me...

We don't want people releasing "reverse engineered" server tools as it only complicates our life. We can't support these tools and the users who use servers don't know that the problems (they might be having) aren't MTA related and are instead because of a badly coded server admin program. Anyway, we really do not recommend releasing any such programs.

Aeron's mIRC addon does the job fine for the moment, and in the future, there will probably be no need for such things (in their current form anyway).

Releasing any such program as open source could cause serious damage to the community, for obvious reasons.

eAi

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Aeron's mIRC addon does the job fine for the moment, and in the future, there will probably be no need for such things (in their current form anyway).

So what you literally say is: f*** all linux users?

Running mIRC is not an option for me, my workstation makes too much noise to run 24/7, and emulating windows just kills the performance of my server.

Running a program on the server itself is just an ideal solution. Also on there it can communicate easily with MySQL, RRD, or any tool you can think of.

Saying that there will be no need for such things in the future is probably not correct (I don't know what features are planned in 0.4 and further). But I think that unless you build ingame administration into the server itself a need for such programs will continue to exist. And I also think that for statistics you impossibly can support all types of logging that's wanted, thus creating another need for the program.

You also speak of non MTA related problems caused by a badly coded program. For this matter there a phenomenon called 'testing'. The program already runs over 2 weeks non-stop on my server, causing no apparent problems. So I think it's pretty safe to say the program is not a source of additional problems.

(OT: Testing is a point where the MTA team can learn something. For someone who knows only a bit about socket programming and reverse-engineering it's extremely easy to actually CRASH the windows 0.3.1 server (so don't give me a lecture a badly coded programs...))

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I totally agree with TBOT... MTAMa does a great job.. For windows users.. i don't know what kind of expansion possibilities you have in mind for scripting and gamemodes in 0.4, but if MTAMA is still required, there should be a linux variant of it.

What is the use of a linux server if there's no possibility to adminster it from the same computer, without using VMWare as i did before testing i switched.

What alternative does the MTA team suggests for a admintool, which can be used ingame, and should run under linux... If they'll just take a look at this program, they'll see it's proper coded, and then they can easily check the way the protocol has been implemented.

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We don't mean coding problems. ie crashing/instability. We refer to problems caused by people abusing the information they can obtain about mta via your source.

Please respect our request that you do not put the mod that thousands enjoy playing at risk of becoming unplayable due to the potentially dangerous release of your 'bot'

I appreciate that linux users are unable to use mirc easily. Note that the mtama is an addon. a bonus. not something included with mta. Linux users have similar problems when wanting to PLAY mta. Do you complain to rockstar that the gta3 series is win32 based?

Aeron worked with me all the way through mtama development. From conception to release. Ensuring the entire team approved of and provided input regarding its release and content. Perhaps visiting us on our irc and maintaining a similar dialogue would be more constructive and lead to something approved for release.

Edited by Guest
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