Guest Posted April 9, 2003 Share Posted April 9, 2003 I don't know if anyone has brought up this topic before, because I haven't really looked enough around the boards. But to the team I was just curious if you have ever considered going open source eventually. With open source you would get the same credit (unless of course some b*stard puts his name on your code, but most people are more honest than that) and in addition it would allow the project to greatly and rapidly evolve. You could still reject other people changed, and if they wanted to implement them they'd have to start their own strand which is not likely to be more successful than your main strand. The best advantage is you would be able to receive tons of input and assistance from anyone out there willing to help, without having to include them directly in the project and thus not hindering yourselves by over complications of too many programmers. Admittedly, prob now open source is not the best idea, but once the project is rather stable, and your ideas are mostly implemented, I think it would be pretty sweet. Link to comment
Scaramanga Posted April 9, 2003 Share Posted April 9, 2003 I think its really unnecessary. Exposing the source code will only make cheats and hacks easier to create and will get other people to make more multiplayer mods for gta3. Link to comment
Asbah Posted April 9, 2003 Share Posted April 9, 2003 Well I think it would be nice for MTA to go open source, it would really open the window to new mods, maybe new games on the online version. I think that it's just a case of needing to take the good with the bad. More Online Mods = Good Hackers = Bad I don't know how bad of a problem hackers will be, if people feel like it will be a huge problem then maybe you shouldn't go open source. I'm always more partial to the most possible mods available. Link to comment
Iggy Posted April 10, 2003 Share Posted April 10, 2003 yeh i think we could have a bunch of people keep making the little part they know better and all of it would add up dso quickly wed have the ultimate mod. Link to comment
Gtatari Posted April 10, 2003 Share Posted April 10, 2003 Before, i posted something like "The Ultimate Addition" - or something alon those lines. it basically was a Game Mode Editior - you get a map of LC, and can plance spawns, cars, ect.. all the needed game object. anyway i think that it should be open soruce. also: as far as hacks: what kind are we talking about? like for example: "Inf Health" if you had a modded client you could do stuff like that.. a solution would be instead have the server keep track of your health, and if it detects a difference from client then you are expelled from the game. - thats just one idea, im sure its not flawless, but i think that there will always be a way around things. and if they really wanted to hack, its not that hard to get a vb decompilier, and then they'll get the source anyhow. Link to comment
Prostheus Posted April 11, 2003 Share Posted April 11, 2003 I voted yes to the open-source, but only parts of it perhaps. Like the parts that actually interact with GTA3, not the parts that are purely server/client (or perhaps parts of those parts???) If it was a choice for either full open-source or nothing, I'd pick nothing. Because, as others have said, you'll get hackers ruining game-play. Link to comment
MTA Team Blokker_1999 Posted April 11, 2003 MTA Team Share Posted April 11, 2003 the source of 0.1 was posted, but later deleted. The problem when we are gonna post the source is that other ppl are gonne use it to create other mp mods, which means not only that there are gonna be more mp mods, but that the overall quality of them will be low and that poeple are gonna say, we have tried so many, we don't need to try MTA, it will be like all the others. Also as has been stated : cheaters will find a lot of easy ways to cheat in the game! Link to comment
Guest Posted April 14, 2003 Share Posted April 14, 2003 I realise the concerns, but if you look at a lot of other open source programs out there, unless the team is unwilling to accept evolution almost always people only improve the code and submit changes. I understand the concern for other Multiplayer Mods, but as long as the original team is included is clearly included in the open sources files, as they are required to be they do get credit. In addition as I said before, open source is something that needs to wait no doubt, the code needs to be sufficent so that others go: Why would we want to recreate from the ground up, instead we will just improve this code and sumbit patches. As for hackers, yes initially the hacking would be insane. BUT hacking is insane for all multiplayers, and if you play against people you know or people who actually enjoy having fun hacking is not a concern. In addition over time, open sources seems to prove much more secure than non-open sources (I mean seriously IIS holes compared to Apache flaws.) What open source DOES prevent over a long term is hacking, because the people who otherwise would feel cool because there are writing hacks, and write patches to holes, make a contribution and feel cool that way. Anyways, just an opinon. I don't even care that much, but I thoguht it was worth expressing =D Link to comment
ijsf Posted April 15, 2003 Share Posted April 15, 2003 As blokker already said, I first posted the source of 0.1 but due to copycats and that stuff i removed it. I'm a great lover of open source, i'm member on sourceforge.net, i've got linux and if i could i would donate some money to the greatest open source project, but MTA is something that is against the open source idea. It is a mod, not a game or a program.. so people could make a mod for a mod, and the greatest problem of all: people could base their mp mod on our source and that makes it only worse. Link to comment
Sintax Posted April 15, 2003 Share Posted April 15, 2003 I've coded the begginings of an MP mod in C++, but I can't figure out how to spawn actors for the other players or anything. Maybe I'll give everyone the source to that if I'm still stuck later on. Link to comment
ijsf Posted April 15, 2003 Share Posted April 15, 2003 and what are these beginnings? communications between client(s) and server(s)? why is everyone making a mp mod after we did Link to comment
Sintax Posted April 15, 2003 Share Posted April 15, 2003 I got memory reading, writing, tcp/ip communication, both client and server programs, everything but the damn actors. In C++ with a spiffy MFC interface. I was bored. Link to comment
ijsf Posted April 15, 2003 Share Posted April 15, 2003 yes and that is the biggest problem for you. you'll have to spend weeks to find all these memory addresses. listen, why do you think it's taking so long for us? if you got these things you mentioned, you only got 5% of the whole idea. and btw you'll never find these actors Link to comment
Sintax Posted April 15, 2003 Share Posted April 15, 2003 (edited) How dare you, sir?! ...Hey, do you guys need a C++ coder? Edited April 15, 2003 by Guest Link to comment
ijsf Posted April 15, 2003 Share Posted April 15, 2003 Well, sorry if i did rude but i mean, you can't find these actors, because they're simply not there. The memory addresses of GTA3 is the whole idea behind it. Link to comment
Sintax Posted April 15, 2003 Share Posted April 15, 2003 Hey, I really don't understand that last post, but I'm gonna ask a question anyway. You guys are gonna use a modified main.scm for the actors and such in the next version, right? Or is that just for the multiplayer modes? (Although it seems it would be easier to program those modes into the server) Barna's program seems to spawn actors and cars no problem without modifying any files, so I guess it's possible. Link to comment
ijsf Posted April 15, 2003 Share Posted April 15, 2003 well sorry for explaning things so stupid, i thought you were talking about somethings else than main.scm, but barna is using players instead of actors. and we're using the main.scm. btw we need a c++ coder yeah Link to comment
|Y|aNi}{ Posted April 16, 2003 Share Posted April 16, 2003 I really don't think that MTA should be Open Source because it will make the work easier for people that want to make multiplayer hacks for Gta3MTA or for people that want to make their own MP mods and that will copy most of the hard coding that the mta's team did... Link to comment
Guest Posted April 16, 2003 Share Posted April 16, 2003 Hey, I can understand that anyone would like to give credit to MTA for all of their work on this mod, yet if the code went open source think of all the new ideas and instead of 10 or so team memebers of Mta working on the mod now 100's more could be helping and tweaking out all the little minor details. If anyone doesn't want it to be modded in a way to enhance it further than what the MTA team has already done than you probably don't like the idea that a multiplayer MOD is even out, to me it just sounds a little hypocritical (not modding a mod???). Anyway I just thought that if it went open source so many more people could work on it and one overall product could converge at MTA.com and the Mta team would release a better more enhanced version/s... My 2 cents Link to comment
Kent747 Posted April 17, 2003 Share Posted April 17, 2003 Jobias.. thats why they have a mod suggestions section on the forum.. people give input, they implement them.. its a good relationship... as far as the mod goes i haven't seen many nearly as involved with the players on suggestions for future versions... I think the forums are a good place for suggestions, not giving everybody the code... if the code was open source, everybody would have some other version and compatibility would be an issue, let alone cheaters... Kent Link to comment
Guest Posted April 17, 2003 Share Posted April 17, 2003 As to suggestions on the forums, I respect all of them. They all have their valid points and positions and I think it's good people actually come up with their own opinions. I too would like to be able to voice my opinion without being viewed as bias or whatever you (kent) think. Now it is not always easy to understand sometimes what one may write down. What one views on paper, or a computer screen for that matter may sound totally different when placed into spoken words. On the position of Cheaters, remember this is my opinion, I feel that no matter what you do open source or not there would/will be cheaters. For example take a game like Diablo 2. Blizzard went out of it's way to make its characters saved on its secure servers yet still there were hacks and cheaters,not to get off subject i fell that no matter open source or not there will always unfortunately be cheaters. I do not feel that open source would change the fact of cheaters or enhance them. Closed Source is good and I fell the MTA team has done an amazing job just making a non-multiplayer game multiplayer, I just fell if it went open source the team could get more help. I only feel strongly about this because i have seen it happen with other mod developers and work great. Best example of this would be the mods for the high heat baseball series. Anyway this is just my opinion. Link to comment
maksio5 Posted April 17, 2003 Share Posted April 17, 2003 i think better not to do it. if somebody wants to make new mod or something, he can send it to mta team and ask them if they can add it Link to comment
Guest Posted April 22, 2003 Share Posted April 22, 2003 Why not go open source? Cheating is a null point it could happen right now anyway. Why be so protective of a mod? Open source will make the project much more efficient because people could find errors and fix them. It just seems a little rediculous to me to be so protective over a mod project. Link to comment
Guest Posted April 22, 2003 Share Posted April 22, 2003 Hey Chris, Surprised you posted...got bored of high heat forums for 2 seconds i take it. Anyway here is another person who thinks the pros of open source outweigh the cons. And good point on the idea that it's a mod. I can understand a respectable software company being a little cautious about going open source they'd lose money main reason but a freeware mod what have you got to lose? I thought you said you didn't really care who makes it as long as you have a good working mod and that also you weren't in competition with GGM so y should you be afraid of anyone else. I just think the idea should really be considered and i think there is a lot of talented people out there that could help with the mod. Going open source or not.... not my decision so at this point it seems as though the MTA team makes the choice. Link to comment
me Posted April 23, 2003 Share Posted April 23, 2003 Open source it, BUT: the license would either require the person to credit the MTA team, or make it impossible to copy the code over to a new mod, so the code would be for educational purposes only. or you could sell the code (wonderful money!) to buy IJsVogel (change your name to something I can remember dammit!) a new Shuttle PC Link to comment
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